St Michaels Est

AuthorMessage DateMessage
Mary Mc30/06/2010Can anyone tell me exactly what is happening with this estate. I was talking to somebody living there and was told that the remaining 5 or 6 tenants have got offers of houses elsewhere. Does this mean DCC don't have to build any hses now and will it be all private. When will the remaining
blocks be knocked?
Peter McDonagh30/06/2010Hi Mary,

There is some information on the website of the St. Michael's Regeneration Team at www.stmichaelsestate.ie

There's also information on the Dublin City Council Website. After the PPP failed DCC convened a Special Housing Task Force on Housing Regeneration Projects. Here's what the task force had to say ...

Due to changed economic circumstances the delivery of a number of these regeneration proposals is no longer viable under the PPP process by which they were being pursued. Nevertheless, the City Council remains committed to the regeneration of the areas, and to this end established a multi-disciplinary Special Housing Taskforce to examine all options for the successful regeneration of St. Michaels Estate. Research has indicated that, whereas the residential market is significantly depressed at this time, the strategic location of the St Michael’s Estate site and the nature of its context is such that there would be demand for commercial development. The strategy was determined to simultaneously undertake redevelopment from both ends and work towards the centre. The northern development will be mixed use commercial, community and residential. This would be undertaken following relocation of the existing uses and delivered by going to market with a quality development brief. The southern development will be mixed tenure residential, undertaken by Dublin City Council delivering on the already agreed Part 8 to present day sustainability, energy efficiency and size requirements.
The strategy also provides for the delineation of a central public open space ‘ Parade Ground Square’ addressing the protected structures of the former Richmond Barracks at an early stage. This space would form a central focus to the overall development as it is delivered over a multiple year timeframe. Initially it would be simple in its finish but would be enhanced by an injection from each phase of surrounding development as they proceed. The space will therefore be in continuous public use right through the development timeframe, but will also on completion be a significant urban space, acknowledging its historic context.

The first phase (2010-2011) includes the regeneration of a 4 acre section of St. Michaels beside the canal which will consist of 76 homes (32 social, 44 affordable) plus community use. The first phase also includes de-tenanting of the front commercial site and forming a new Parade Ground Square with the football pitches. The first phase is due to start in 2010 however there have been some recent hold-ups by Waterways Ireland (they have jurisdiction over the canal).

The second phase (2012-2014) includes additional development in the 4 acre site beside the canal consisting of 61 homes (36 social, 25 affordable) along with construction of new commercial/community
frontage with 125 homes and the development of Parade Ground square.

The third phase (2015-2017) includes the development of the remainder of the residential component of St. Michaels with 325 private homes including 20% social and affordable
The third phase also includes the development of astand alone Family
Resource Centre with civic space and the completion of Parade Ground square.

There are two important caveats to the aforesaid matters. Make of them what you will...

1. Dublin City Council will continue to be open to considering other alternative solutions which would deliver the regeneration of St Michael’s Estate in a more timely of effective manner.

2. The proposals are now put before the Council and if agreed will form an integral part of Dublin City Council’s Housing Action Plan. Overall delivery and funding is subject to the necessary approval of the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government.

Hope that helps to shed some more light on the subject Mary.
Mary Mc01/07/2010Peter,I have read all about that. I have heard the latest is that the first phase is now only 2 acres. I know that it was supposed to start in Sept it is now delayed. I knew someone who was waiting to be housed on the site and now has accepted a house outside the area. Surely that is telling us something, this person could have move years ago but wanted to stay in Inchicore.
Alan C01/07/2010That sounds like an awful mess of a plan. What a load of bull.

They really should just sell this site to a private developer, zone it mixed use and apply the 20% social housing provision.

Instead they are trying to build a mess, total or neal tatal social housing (even though the council moved away from this as an unsucessful model more than a decade ago) and they will stick on a few shops which are completely un-needed and will just add to the urban-decay in Inchicore Village.

It's time the Council gave up, they are not capable of realizing the potential of this site. I think someone who has put millions and millions at steak would make damn sure that it's full potential was realized and that it was a success.
Alan C01/07/2010ok so the St Michael's Website says that over EUR20 Million has already been spend on this project! And all we have to show for this is more dereliction and the distruction of a community.
And they are angry about that? Should they not be ashamed?

The Council could have sold the site for 10 Million and be 30 Million better off today. What a complete failure it has been.

That regeneration board are just going to make this worse, they are a talking shop that are just hindering the development of this site, they money is there ready to go as soon as the project is ready, but this board are not able to manage or deliver the project and are a vehicle for interference from all corners which is an un-manageable risk on any project.

Get rid of the regeneration board - sell this site or hand it over to the OPW to develop. Either that or be ashamed and stop blaming the government, when they hand responsability to the regeneration board, that board can not just hand it back when it all goes wrong.
Shame on you all.
Daithi01/07/2010There is plenty of open space in st michaels. surely this could be utilised by a local sports club until such time that a decision is made on it's future?
Daithi03/07/2010Perhaps a group should approach the local councillors about using waste ground ... http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1926/en/act/pub/0008/index.html
Sean08/07/2010I know it is only the herald and is no better than tabloid dross but this might come as some positive news

http://www.herald.ie/national-news/city-news/finally-eyesore-housing-blocks-could-soon-bite-dust-2250828.html
Mary Mc08/07/2010Great news about the demolition of the estate. However I wonder where the Family Res. Centre will move to, they were in the tower block on their own, holding everything up. That block should have come down years ago.
Alan C09/07/2010I would cautiously welcome this development, however there is a problem with it. They are just going to knock down the remaining buildings and extend this wasteland over the whole site now. They were meant to construct Phase 1 of the scheme, however they dont have planning permission for this, and the plans they have submitted are flawed and there are major objections and this is holding this stage up.
I would expect to see a wasteground there for years to come ....
Mary Mc09/07/2010This site would be ideal for a supermarket and a swimming pool.
We have enough apartments in Inchicore and while they may be private they can be rented out to anyone. This site needs a new lease of life, we had Keogh Sq and then Michaels Est so something different would be ideal.
Michael O'Flanagan09/07/2010As A member of The Board of St. Michael's Estate Regeneration.......... I can tell you Alan that we have planning permission..... (part 8) ..... it is not subject to objection...... has been in place for several years. Bids have been received for the building of the !st Phase.....and work will commense this year. Any of the three councillors on the Board.... Clare Byrne, John Gallagher or Criona Ni'Dalaigh can fill you in on the finer details
Alan c10/07/2010Apologies Michael, it was an alteration to this permission for some changes to phase 1 I was referring to. This is being objected to by the Cemetary I believe.

What is being built here? Since the entire St michaels community has been moved there seems little need for new houses on the site, there are plenty around for people on the housing list.

And the demolition plan is to level the buildings plant grass and place giant stone boulders around it. This will just create a bigger waste ground in the interim (which could be longer than planned as happened before) and encurage anti-social behavior.

A lot of people think the site is in need of a completely new vision, maybe we are missing something?
Mary Mc10/07/2010It was a pity the original plan didn't get off the ground. I am talking about the plan in1998, where 360 houses were to
be built. I knew someone on the then Task Force from 1997 -2004. As far as I can recall it was 3 estates on the site and a mix of public and private. Then St pats decided to put in plans for their stadium and held everything up. We could have had the site developed by now. The decision to demolish was taken in early 1998, I don't blame DCC, I think too many people wanted different things.
Michael O'Flanagan10/07/2010Yeah Alan.......... you are right about the need for a bigger vision for the wider 10 acre site. Nothing has been decided about this........ the" multi-task force"........ set out some guide lines after the collapse of the MacNamara plan........ but anything could happen on this site now........ The building of a small number of Social houses for the residents of the estate was agreed by Brendan Kenny.... as a concession to the local community........ I mean people in social housing are human beings and just as entitled to cherish their heritage ......... some of them are descended from the residents of Richmond Barracks and Keogh Square .... yeah it should not be just the prerogative of those who are wealthy enough to buy up property in this area to say what goes on around here.
Alan C12/07/2010Michael, it's really great to get your view on this. One thing is for sure; everyone would like to see St Michaels developed and there is universal fustration and disappointment with the failures so far.

I dont agree with all of your points, while I understand that everyone in the community should have a say, I think it's worng to section off those that are from social housing and treat them differently, I also think it's wrong to build an estate of entirely social housing.

Dublin City Council have moved away from the model of building social housing, and instead adoped an approach where up to 20% of new housing would be used for social and affordable housing. Thereby integrating people in the community and ending the situation where those on social housing were isolated from the rest of society. Part of the failure of the Major Dublin Council housing projects, including St Michaels, was the fact that they were isolated and marginalised.

I dont want to be overly critical, but there are some genuine concerns with this model of housing.

Also I can't understand why after knocking down the flats large boulders would be placed around the site, this is an appaling idea and will turn the site into a no-go area attracting anti-social behaviour until development is complete (if ever)
Michael O'Flanagan12/07/2010Alan

(1). the MacNamara plan . Accepted by DCC and adopted by the Board ..was for a mix of social housing, affordable and pirvate housing together with commercial and civic facilites. It was not the fault of the Board or DCC that this plan failed.

(2).I did not section off those that are from social housing and treat them differently

So dont misquote me!


I pointed out that people in social housing are human beings and just as entitled to cherish their heritage ......... some of them are descended from the residents of Richmond Barracks and Keogh Square .... yeah it should not be just the prerogative of those who are wealthy enough to buy up property in this area to say what goes on around here. I stand by that! .. any attempt to down-grade the rights of people living in social hosing will exposed for what it is.. blatant snobbery!

(3)I attended the meeting of Board of St. Michaels Regeneration today and I have been assured by DCC that the following items are untrue;

(a)it was an alteration to this permission for some changes to phase 1 I was referring to. This is being objected to by the Cemetary I believe.

(b) THE demolition of the last 100 flats at the rundown St Michael's Estate in Inchicore has been given the go-ahead. Dublin City Council has agreed to allow the last four blocks of flats at the controversial complex to be knocked.

DCC Public Relations Dept. will be contacting the Evening Herald to have this statement corrected.
Alan c12/07/2010
I still think it would be a mistake to build social-only housing estate here. That isolates and marginalize people and was never the plan.

Planning application REF: 2716/10 below is a link to the Letter from the Glasnevin Trust which they submitted in objection to the alterations applied for this year

https://docs.google.com/fileview?id=0ByAxo_D8EP4lNTE3NTkxMzMtOWUwZi00NjQ4LTgzN2QtOTgxYTBkMGZjNTRm&hl=en&authkey=CIqLwMUO
Michael O'Flanagan12/07/2010Alan.......The reason why the 2 acre site is Social Housing Only is because that is the only option open to Dublin City Council under part 8 planning regulation. Do you suppose it would be reasonable to abandon plans to provide housing for tenants who had been promised and waiting for housing since 1998? There is no current plan to build Social Housing on the remaining 10 acres. As for your pet 20% provision......... that was a farce....... honoured in the breach...... as are all development plans....and area zonings...... ignored by DCC planning Dept and An Bord Pleanala...... time after time after time.
Alan C12/07/2010Michael everyone wants to see St Michaels as a success. And I'm not saying dont build houses for this community.
What I am saying is dont build a council estate, if that means making the residents co-owners or giving them full ownership then so be it.
But the council estate model has failed and been abandoned and was the very reason the flats were a disaster.
Or reserv some of the housing for rental on the private market and eventually sell them when the market picks up, but have a mix however its done.

It's just a thought, obviously I am looking at all of this from the outside and you have the inside view. I dont think they are conflicting views.
Michael O'Flanagan13/07/2010Alan.. I not interested in an esoteric debate about the merits of housing models I have been involved in practical community work in Inchicore for 30 years.. the good of this community is my total concern.not the transport needs of the people of Lucan or Timbuktu.
I dont see myself as being eligible to make policy for every aspect of domestic and foreign affairs.
Alan C13/07/2010Michael I don't doubt your commitment to the people affected and its great that they have representives like yourself working on their bahalf.
I'm sorry if it seems I'm being overly critical, thats not the intention.

I do think its wise and proper to debate the St Michaels Project and specifically the shortcomings, nobody expects the final solution to be perfect but where there are failings surely its proper to debate this.

Specifically I dont think it is ideal or necessary for children to gown up in St Michaels new estate where they are isolated in a marginalised community wehre every single person on their street is in solcial housing.
By integrating withing the community these children would grow up in the same environment as everyone else instead of being isolated.

A simple solution is to set specific targets and funding available to encourage ownership of this new housing. Surely the best compromise would be to give these people a half share in their new homes?
rita fagan 13/07/2010Rita Fagan 13/07/2010 For information purposes i would like to respond to Mary Mc, and thank her for giving me the opportunity to talk to the whole community of Inchicore about the daily work of the Family Resource Centre Community Development Project based in the last standing tower block in St. Michaels Estate.
On the 22nd of September this very year we as an organisation will celebrate twenty five years of existence serving the most marginal. We have a rich track record that we are proud of.
Through these years we have provided much needed assistance, help and services to families, women, children, senior citizens, men, new communities, local community projects and organisations with many positive outcomes.
In true community development terms we have been a catalyst for the founding of organisations that was set up to address the needs as identified at the time, for example; St. Michaels Parish Youth Project, The Inchicore and Kilmainham Development Group, Hesed House Counselling Service, we played a lead role with others lobbying for the Inchicore Drugs team and the Canal's Community Partnership . We set up and an run the Inchicore Outreach Centre which supports women in this and the wider Canal Communities experiencing violence against women of which more than 100 women have been worked with in the past year.
In the year of the millenium the Family Resource Centre CDP was awarded the overall Guinness Living Dublin Award for its innovative work to address educational disadvantage through its After-School Project. Children who are falling behind in the primary schools get help and to remain in the school system as a result.
Our innovative work with the Irish Museum of Modern Art resulted in many exhibitions by our men, women and children. The most renowned work was 'Unspoken Truths' in 1992, created by 32 working class women from Sean McDermot s St. and St. Michaels Estate and artist Aibhe Murphy. This fourteen piece installation focused on the stories and memories in their lives. It was launched as one of the first community exhibitions at IMMA by president Mary Robinson in 1992 to a gathering of 570 people. On the night president Robinson said we were making history.
Indeed we have made history in many ways down through the years. In 1997 we again launched the work of 17 local women who collaborated with four artists on the making of 'Once is Too Much' the exhibition of 11 mixed installations focusing on violence against women. This exhibition stood alongside AndyWarhol and Kiki Smith in IMMA for 14 weeks. It went on to travel Ireland to many museums and was a catalyst for many of the community responses to the issue of violence against women around Ireland.
Our exhibition 'Manifesto' of which we worked on with artist Ailbhe Murphy is a permanent installation in the International Praxis Centre in Deluth, Minnesota, USA.
People in Inchicore may not understand what we do. While the premises we work from is based on St. Michaels Estate our geographical landscape is the lower Inchicore area. Our remit from the government is to work with those individuals and families who are marginal in the community. many people seek our advice and help regarding deep problems and issues, also we provide in the tower Mary talks about much valued and valuable activities;
-Local education for women who have left school early and are isolated in their homes.
-leadership training providing skills for those interested in volunteering in their community
-Yoga Sessions for senior citizen women which contributes to their mental health and wellbeing
-A Wednesday breakfast morning for men and women senior citizens and activities of which 25 attend
-A small developing mens group who like to go on outings
-Women's history class once a month for a group of West African Women
-A warm loving multi-cultural creche to support mother's who participate in education and go on to formal education in the Emmet Road College
-An After-schools programme which operates between September and June of which 63 children attend daily where they get help with their homework and also participate in the cultural programme of song, dance and art.
-In June both senior men and women are given a small holiday away from their environment
-In July for one month the Family Resource Centre CDP runs a Summer Programme of Activities and outings for both families and senior citizens
-All year round we have an open door policy for people who seek help with their problems etc.
Yes the Family Resource Centre CDP is at the heart of the Regeneration with the tenants past and present. This work is documented in Dr. John Bissett's Book; Regeneration, Public good or private profit?
I do hope this explains a few things .My response is to the to the suggestion that we in the Family Resource Centre CDP are holding up the Tower from being demolished. What is missing from this analysis is the fact that we the Family Resource Centre CDP have worked on the design of four different promised buildings with DCC to house our organisation into its future.
The people and community project on St. Michaels Estate have been let down by this government not once but four times exactly, people have left the estate with broken hearts because they could not live in the conditions any longer. The state has failed us all. To rise after the first disappointment was hard but to get up off your knees and to have your hopes and dreams shattered four times you would have to agree is a lot to bear.
Mary I am afraid until this or the next government keepl their broken promises we the Family Resource Centre CDP have no choice but to remain in the tower doing what we believe to be really valuable work in the lower Inchicore area.
At the moment this government is successfully tearing the heart out of communities throughout Ireland. Lets all be supportive of one another, lets not get sucked into the agenda of divide and rule. Lets respect each other. If anyone out there needs our help, do not hesitate to come around and talk with us. We could be a key to the solution. We are good listeners. We always begin with people where they are at . We are active in the defence of those who are being pushed further and further away from the centre of society to the edge and sometimes over a cliff!
No matter what anyone thinks or feels, what has happened to the people of St. Michaels Estate, O'Devaney Gardens and Dominic Street has been a case of clear injustice!

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Alan C13/07/2010Well done Rita, that is fantastic work you are doing.
Well done to Michael too and thanks for allowing me to question things, having done so I can honestly say I am impressed and delighted by your commitment.
Mary Mc14/07/2010Rita, I know what your project does, but
could you not have got flats in the 3 smaller blocks when you moved, now in the paper it was reported all the bloclks are to be demolished, does this mean you have to move again or will you stay in the tower block.
Rita Fagan 14/07/2010

Dear Mary
Im afraid that was not an option with DCC as we had to move from 2 small blocks as well as from tower 3, our buildings were all ready being used by DCC for estate management and they were ready for a community organisation, over the years we were burnt out 7 time and always have had to get back in and start again.
The small blocks are to be pulled when the last tenants vacate them with their letter to return.
As an organisation we are in negotiations for our own future as well as those in front of the site, thats as much as i can tell you, dont forget there is an intercultural event between 2pm and 4.30pm today on the green, all welcome,

Rita Fagan
Sean21/07/2010It was good to see an organised football training session happening on the field in the estate last night. It would be great if this is what it is used for in the future.
Alan C26/07/2010For anyone interested there is references to St Michaels in the following Opinion Article
http://www.thepost.ie/commentandanalysis/the-law-parades-its-privilege-in-lavish-new-home-50693.html
Mary Dunne10/04/2011It's now April 9th and the empty blocks are still standing. Could anyone tell me will they be knoocked down or not, attracting very dodgy people noe
Mary Mc10/04/2011I asked a councillor when the blocks would be knocked. I was told 1 block is due to be demolished in the next week or so. The other blocks had people living there until Christmas, so permission has to be granted for these.
The tower block still has the family resource centre, including a creche and afterschool. God knows when that will be knocked.
Elaine24/04/2011Hi. I see they are starting work on the first block at present.

Mary - when you see they need "permission" to start on the next two blocks do you know does this mean planning permission? I just took a look at the planning section of the DCC website, and can't see any applications - (mind you there is nothing there is relation to the first block also).

Does anyone have anymore information in relation to the time-lines?

In addition to being extremely unattractive, these blocks are attracting some worrying anti-social behaviour. I have several times seen fires alight at the base of the buildings.
Mary Mc25/04/2011I think it is planning permission. The tower block is still occupied by the FRC, but rumour has it they may move into pre fabs, The blocks are unsightly and are attracting gangs but I don't think there is a date as to when they will be demolished.
Elaine18/07/2011Hi all. Just wondering if anyone has further updates as to when the remaining three blocks will be demolished?

I searched again on the planning section of DCC website, and it seems planning permission for demolition of all 4 was granted in July 2010.
Mary Mc19/07/2011Demolition is due to start on the 2 small
blocks around Sept/Oct. The bottom of the tower is still occupied, so that won't
be demolished this year. There is nothing planned for this site as far as I know. I searched everywhere but to no
avail. I would like to know what will happen to the site.
JB24/07/2011I heard that there is nothing planned for michael's est site, they are looking for ideas as to how to use this space for the best. There is talk a part of it might be used as a car park, but what else can it be used for. I don't think there will be anything built. I heard that the small blocks will be demolished this year. It is good that building has started up at the canal, although I don't agree with more apartments.
Tim26/07/2011It would be great if they made it into a green area like a park or something and maybe held a farmers market there every now and then.
JB27/07/2011I think a farmer's market would be brilliant, even if it was only on every 2 weeks.
Judi28/07/2011Cop-on to yourselves, no farmer's market would go near that site, it's a dump.
As long as the Council own it it will remain a shite-hole. Best thing for it would be to sell if off to Aldi's or anyone who wants to do something with it other than the council.
JB28/07/2011The Council can't sell the site, nobody has the money. We are only talking about using the site until somebody wants to buy it, it is a waste at the moment and surely it would be better off with something on it.
Judi28/07/2011The Council have already spent over 20 Million on the site, and the result is a giant shite-hole.
No point in hoping for anything useful from them, only hope is for it to be sold.

Im sure Aldi's and Lidl have plenty of cash, they claim to be looking for property anyway.
They should seriously offer the site to them and anyone else interested in doing something useful with it.
In the meantime, it would be better if they left it alone, the more they spend on it the more of a shite-hole it becomes.
JB28/07/2011I think the Council would be very happy to get rid of the site.
Melanie29/07/2011On the Irish Times website in the Property section dated yesterday 28/7/11 is an article about the council's refurbishment of Dolphin House in Rialto. It end like this :
"Meanwhile, at St Michaels Estate in Inchicore, Dublin 8, the Council said that work is continuing on the construction of 76 housing units on a two-acre site, 32 of which will be for social housing. The remainder of the 10-acre site is now likely to be sold off. "

Maybe the Irish Times knows something we don't
JB30/07/2011That is what we heard here in Inchicore. The first phase has started up near the canal and that won't be completed until 2013.
I don't know why it takes so long to build that small number of houses. I heard a rumour , as did a lot of people that St Pats would like to build a stadium there.
We all know the site will be sold but we don't know when.
Mary Mc30/07/2011DCC want to get rid of the site, so lets hope something decent is built. A shopping centre would be great, there was a suggestion a few years ago that a supermarket and swimming pool would be the best option if houses were not going to be built. I think DCC should tell people what the latest is, we don't want a stadium, we have one.
John05/12/2011Good to see all the flats have almost gone. There is only 1 more to go.